Greeks and Geeks
Deep diving into the lore behind our favourite Myth, Fantasy and Sci-Fi stories.
Greeks and Geeks
Hades and Persephone: Romance or Horror?
The myth of Hades and Persephone has been fascinating to romance writers and readers alike, but their foundational Greek myth is more of a tale of kidnap and grief than it is anything romantic. How could Hades and Persphone end up being one of the most frequently retold romantic stories? Today we're going to look at the Homeric Hymn to Demeter, Hesiod, and discuss why their story might be a compelling romance.
Bibliography
https://www.theoi.com/Cult/DemeterTitles.html
https://chs.harvard.edu/primary-source/homeric-hymn-to-demeter-sb/
Mystery Cults in the Ancient World- novel
Girl, Goddess, Queen- Bea Fitzgerald
https://www.theoi.com/image/R14.1Haides.jpg
Hello and welcome to Greeks and Geeks, the podcast where I take us on a persnickity yet fun journey deep diving into the lore of our favourite stories. This is the second episode of series 3, which is underworld themed, in celebration of spooky season. If you haven’t listened to the first episode- all about the Underworld itself, do go check it out and see if you get as attached to the spirit of Kalliope as I did.
We briefly discussed the chthonic gods, the gods and goddesses who live in the underworld or whom could travel or be associated with it last week. This week we’re going to dig deeper into the rulers of the underworld, the King and Queen, Hades and Persephone, and in particular, the interpretations of their romance. But can it be called a romance though, especially with the way their story starts? You can come to that decision yourself at the end of the episode.
Hades is one of the three main brothers, the children born from Kronos and Rhea, who were devoured by Kronos and then released in order to overthrow him during the war with the titans, the Titanomachy. The Olympians won that war and, after this, the 3 sons of Kronos (Zeus, Poseidon and Hades) drew lots to determine who would take control of which domain. Zeus got the sky, Poseidon got the oceans and Hades got the Underworld. But he is not the god of death, as we established. He is instead the ruler over the dead and all the beings of the Underworld. He lives there, underground, and sometimes judges the souls of mortals though usually he leaves that up to his 3 judges. He has a pet dog, Cerberus, and he owns a helm of darkness, which he can use to turn invisible. Generally speaking Hades wasn’t thought to be a wicked or cruel god. Out of his 3 brothers, he’s generally seen to be the most even tempered, though most people didn’t want to invoke his name- similarly to a lot of cultures, they didn’t want to speak about death. So those ancient Greeks would have called him “Pluton” which basically means wealth, as wealth comes from under the earth (think gems, yes, but also roots for plants). Other names for him though were things like “host of many” which makes sense really because yeah, think about how every person who’s ever lived ever. Hades has met or will eventually meet them all and now I’m curious how many people are estimated to have lived ever give me a sec…
Ok I just looked it up and apparently, estimates vary of course, debates and blahblahblah, but according to Population Reference Beaureau, 117 billion humans have lived on Earth. Bloody hell, sorry no pun intended. No wonder Hades had a better reputation than his brothers! He’s way too busy dealing with all that. I don’t envy him to be honest! What a busy bee…yes I did just call the Lord of the Dead a busy bee. I’m sure he’d agree if he could look up from his paperwork long enough.
Persephone, on the other hand, is of the next generation of Gods. She’s most often considered to be the daughter of Zeus and Demeter. Demeter is the goddess of harvest, fertility and the earth. Her ephitephs were things like “earth-mother” “giver of bountiful gifts.” Before Persephone became the Queen of the Underworld she was often known as Kore, which means “maiden.” They were worshipped together as mother and daughter in the famous Eleusian mysteries, which is one of the most famous mystery cults of the entire ancient world. For more about mystery cults, check out my previous episode. The Eleusian mysteries lasted for over a millennia and revolved around one of the most famous myths, the kidnapping of Persephone by Hades to make her his bride, and festivals often happened in the autumn time for this reason.
Like many gods and goddesses, Persephone has a vengeful side but in the most popular myths, you often find her appealing to her husband’s gentler sensibilities when she feels sympathy for the dead and the suffering. For example, when Orpheus plays a song in order to gain the King and Queen’s favour and get his recently deceased wife Eurydice back, both Hades and Persephone are deeply moved, but it is Persephone that gets Hades to agree to letting Orpheus bring Eurydice back to the world of the living. Persephone is the goddess of spring as her return from the underworld to the world of the living beings the lifecycle anew and the opposite. When she goes back down to the underworld at the end of summer, the autumn begins.
But why does this happen? Let’s discuss the myth of Hades and Persephone.
(Music)
Based on Hesiod and the Homeric Hymn to Demeter- an epic poem thought in antiquity to have been written by Homer but modern scholars disagree. Nobody really knows.
What the story is about.
He seized her against her will, put her on his golden chariot,
And drove away as she wept. She cried with a piercing voice,
Thereafter, for nine days did the Lady Demeter
wander all over the earth, holding torches ablaze in her hands.
Not once did she take of ambrosia and nectar, sweet to drink,
in her grief, nor did she bathe her skin in water.
She made that year the most terrible one for mortals, all over the Earth, the nurturer of many.
It was so terrible, it makes you think of the Hound of Hādēs. The Earth did not send up
any seed. Demeter, she with the beautiful garlands in her hair, kept them [the seeds] covered underground.
Many a curved plow was dragged along the fields by many an ox—all in vain.
Many a bright grain of wheat fell into the earth— all for naught.
310 At this moment, she [Demeter] could have destroyed the entire population of meropes36 humans
And he found the Lord inside his palace,
seated on a funeral couch, along with his duly acquired bedmate,
the one who was much under duress, yearning for her mother,
It was very much against my will.
This is a story that explains the seasons.
So here we have it. The story of Hades and Persephone. It doesn’t really sound all that romantic, so why is it that there has been an explosion in books recently? We’re going to discuss modern interpretations and analyse why this story of kidnap seems to have held a grip on us mere mortals for so long. I’m also going to discuss some of my biggest problems I have with modern interpretations- without slandering any stories I’ve read because my podcast isn’t about naming and shaming or anything like that.
So let’s get into it. How did kidnapping become romantic?
(MUSIC)
Beauty and the Beast
Hades less bad than his brothers- more faithful
Equals vs being in the shadow of her mother
Overbearing mother trope- WHAT I DISLIKE ABOUT IT
Hades being villainised in popular media- sort of a backlash to it?
Hearing about the myth as a child so toning it down makes it seem more romantic? Or possibly heard other versions of the myth instead such as Persephone walking into the underworld by accident (which is a much much more modern version of the myth)
